by Travis Normand
I will always wonder what the full story on this was.
OnePointSafety
Just another College Football Blog; only this one is better!
by Travis Normand
I will always wonder what the full story on this was.
OnePointSafety 
The truth, more than likely, is somewhere in the middle. And, high priced lawyers along with pressure are often enough to convince a drunk girl that when she says “no” – it doesn’t really count. One thing is for sure, after watching Case McCoy, on the sidelines, he looks dumb enough to sit and watch!
“The truth, more than likely, is somewhere in the middle.”
Agreed.
No means No. This wasn’t a No case but a was she “too inebriated to say yes or no” case by law. Either the tox screen showed that she was sober enough to say no or they couldn’t prove that consent wasn’t given because of her lack of memory in this case. This is why so many of these cases get closed as “unsubstantiated.” The defense attorneys don’t get to cross the witness until trial and this case never got that far. I doubt Roy Minton (Hicks’s lawyer) or Van Hilley (McCoy’s lawyer) even questioned the alleged victim.
Perry Minton not Roy. Same practice different Minton. My Bad.
Sorry, was in a hurry to get it posted that I forgot the citation. The study was conducted in 1996 by US Department of Justice/FBI and the other stats and this one are found in a Fox News article entitled “False Rape Accusations May Be More Common Than Thought.” I am unfamiliar with how to underline Fox News for you.
Wow…thanks a lot. I appreciate that.
My thoughts, gentlemen if you will humor me. I worked for the Texas Department of Criminal Justice for almost 10 years and have a more than passing knowledge of the law and of victimology. I was almost the victim of a sexual assault when I was 15 but was too ashamed to report it. I state this only to let fans know that I am coming from a law enforcement/victim side of the issue. I am also a longhorn fan and am one of Case McCoy’s biggest supporters as regards to his playing time.
1. College students need to be more aware of the risks of drinking and sex. Males need to know what the “stop signs” are and both sexes need to know how to protect themselves, from sexual assaults and from false reports. I recommend to party in groups, keep one member of the group sober, and don’t mix drinking with sex. If your goal is to get drunk (friend’s 21st birthday party, bachelor/ette party, etc.) get drunk but don’t try to pick up members of the opposite sex. If you are going to mingle or try to mate, keep drinking to a minimum. Keep your head on a swivel and police your drink at all times. Do not travel alone at night (even guys need to heed this one.) Mack should make sure his players are trained about the dangers of drinking and sex and put the team on lockdown if he has to. Team rules protect players from false accusations and they wouldn’t have been mixed up in this if they weren’t out drinking at 2:00 in the AM. We all know that no means no, and that underage people can’t consent to sex. But how many know that being too inebriated to say no is a no by law or that you can’t have sex with the mentally incompacitated. Unconscious is also off-limits and I had a friend get attacked at a party while passed out in high school. Bottom line, it is dangerous to have a one-night-stand with people you meet at a bar and I don’t recommend drinking or promescuity as a rule because of my religion but I gave you a guide to protect yourself if you want to take the risks.
2. False rape reports happen to the tune of about 8% of all rapes reported according to a study conducted by the FBI. When you mix in unsubstantiated reports (what this case was closed as) and DNA clearing the defendant the number goes up to about 40%. Keep in mind that only 1 in 4 assaults get reported and only about 60% of those even go to trial. There has only been one academic study done on false reports and the data was skewed. All parties (victim, defendant, police, etc.) would benefit greatly from more detailed and defenitive studies done on this subject. This like an onion with many layers to peel back. We need to work on all the layers to be more effective. Duke Lacrosse woke us up to the reality of the false report and the feminists have been trying for decades to convince us that false reports were non-existant, but 8% is enough that we need to recognize they do indeed exist. Unsubstantiated cases are tricky because often the victim and the defendant are too blitzed to remember details. This is also an issue in date-rape-drug cases. Victims of “real rape” or the violent rape cases often have trama clouding what they remember. Victims of all of the various kinds often don’t report the issue right away. There is also social bias involved. Men think that if a woman wore perfume or a sexy dress that she is permitting them to sex which IS NOT THE CASE. Police are not immune to these biases and victims often struggle with feeling like male police do not believe them or respect their right to say no even if the male cop is being respectful in his questioning and objective in collecting the evidence. Remember evidence is objective and it cleared the two players in this case. I do think all reported assaults need to be thoroughly investigated and that law enforcement and the district attorney’s office need to remain unbiased and objective.
3. I do need to preface this group of thoughts with the statement that I wasn’t there and can only state the following as an opinion. In all honesty, my instinct when reading the redacted police report was that this case was a false report and I wasn’t surprised when the two players were cleared. I do think a sex act occurred but I think the act was indeed consensual and that the victim regretted her actions and cried rape to either reconcile her conscience with her actions, or to get a free morning after pill by claiming a sexual assualt. Case McCoy’s presence was actually a blessing in disguise as he was a witness to what happened and broke the tie between he and she in a he said, she said type of case. My questions involving this case come from why it took SAPD/Bexar County so long to eliminate him from being a suspect in this case. Even if every statement from the woman was correct, it is not against the law to be there or even to watch. They should have separated him from the investigation as soon as they knew that a)he didn’t have any sexual contact with the victim and that B) he didn’t hold her down or make any commands to Hicks during the act. There wasn’t mention of either of these things in the police report even from the victim but I wonder if they took extra time to make sure that Case didn’t participate in anything other than being there or even watching. Case is more famous than Jordan and his name is more prominant. For whatever reason, women in TX especially west of the hill country have almost stalkerish tendancies toward the brothers McCoy including Case. My rad flag radar went up as soon as I found out the girls were Tech students. I wonder if she made it a point to say that he “just stood there and watched” hoping that it would get him in trouble too and was ignorant of the fact that even that isn’t unlawful. There wasn’t evidence of a “he held me down” physically so she couldn’t tell them that and he would deny any other involvement so she went with that. I also wonder if she wanted Case at the club and he denied her. Jordan may have been a plan B for her.
4. I don’t think these two were the only players at the club that night, they were just the only ones caught because of the second incident involving the sex. Case posted two pictures from his phone to instigram that were taken that night and in one of the captions he mentions that it was a teammate’s 21st birthday. Since he is already 21 and Jordan is still 20 for several more months, it had to be someone else’s birthday. This is why I think Mack needs to put the team on lockdown. Most of Case’s drinking related tweets and instigrams seem to be centered around teammates initiating other teammates to drinking at the 21st birthday. Off season, this isn’t as much of an issue if all parties are 21 and they don’t drive or get beligerant with law enforcement. This however, should not be done during the season and especially on road trips or bowl week when they are staying somewhere on the team’s dime. Mack may have to go old school and initiate bed checks in the future. I hope that they catch the other players there and at some point next season hand them each a one game suspension for the curfew violation. It is only fair to Case and Jordan that all who were there be punished equally.
All interesting points. Thanks for the lengthy comment…as I always enjoy good discussion. However, I do have a couple of things I would like to address.
1. When using stats and/or figures, its always good to give a citation. For example, you said that 8% of all rapes reported are false rape reports. You then later stated that this figure can increase to 40% under certain circumstances. While I am not questioning whether or not you are right or wrong, I would like to know where you got your information from. (If for no other reason, than the fact that it bolsters your argument).
2. You later said (in paragraph 3) that: “Even if every statement from the woman was correct, it is not against the law to be there or even to watch.”
Actually, I don’t believe this is correct. If everything the woman said was correct (including that it was rape), then it would be illegal for someone to be in the same room, watching the rape happen. I have no idea if what she said is accurate or not, however, I do know that if what she said were true, and he did stand there and watch, then there are crimes he could be charged with. My guess is that the Police held him long enough to make sure they had enough facts, and could determine whether or not any of the chargeable crimes fit (and whether it was worth charging him).
Great post. Thanks for the comment.
It isn’t illegal to be there or to watch. It is illegal to hold her down or force either of them to have sex. This would include him ordering the others to do any sex acts without permission or him inciting the other one to do any actions. I will find the law and post it for clarification. Thanks for your reply.
Texas Penal Code Section 22.011 is sexual assault. Nothing in there about being there or watching. Too long to post here, but if y’all want to it is easy to find online.
I wouldn’t expect it to be codified. I would expect a conviction for watching someone get raped/sexually assaulted would be found only in case law, as it would be dependent on the circumstances.
However, if as in this case, there was no sexual assault…then it would be impossible to convict the observer of anything. After all, you would need an underlying crime first, before you could charge the observer (if you can charge him at all).
Gentlemen, I have a few thoughts on this so humor me. I do have a criminal justice background and was almost the victim of a date rape at 15. I am saying this to say that I usually come at these from both a law enforcement and victim oriented angle. However I am also a Longhorn fan and believe that Case should be this team’s starting quarterback. He was innocent until proven guilty and they didn’t have enough to charge him with.
1. Thoughts about Drinking and Sex: Mack needs to make sure his guys are aware of the dangers of mixing drinking with sex. He needs to crack down on drinking binges that occur during the season and bowl week. All college students need to be aware of the stop signs and how to prevent sexual assaults and false reports. My advice:
a. Party in groups and keep at least one member of your party sober. They can get you safely home and they can keep you out of trouble.
b. Keep your head on a swivel and police your drink at all times.
c. Don’t travel alone on college campuses and keep to well lit paths at night. This goes for male and female students. My future brother-in-law had a son murdered while walking on A&M campus at night.
d. Don’t mix drinking and sex. If you are going to get drunk (friend’s 21st birthday or a bachelor/ette party) don’t try to pick up members of the opposite sex. If you are going to mingle or try to meet somebody, don’t drink much.
e. Longhorn players should obey team rules. They are designed to protect them. J Hicks and C McCoy wouldn’t have been mixed up in this if they were in their hotel room and not partying at 2:00 in the AM.
2. Thoughts on rape and false reports
a. False reports account for 8% of all rapes reported according to the FBI.
b. Feminists have been trying for years to make us believe that false reports don’t happen, but 8% suggests that they do.
c. Duke Lacrosse raised awareness of false rape reports and the damage that they can do to young men accused.
d. More studies need to be conducted to study false reports and how they relate to unsubstantiated reports (like this case) and cases where DNA clears the defendant but a rape did occur. When you mix the statistics on these, cases not going to trial goes up to about 40%. It would benefit all parties to be able to prevent these issues in the future.
e. This is a multi-faceted issue with many tricky parts.
f. Victims are often too-blitzed to remember details and those victims of violent attacks often have their memories clouded by trauma. This leads to issues in unsubstantiated and wrong defendant cases.
g. Societal biases make victims feel like cops and DA’s don’t believe them. Many men think that perfume, make up, or a sexy dress is a yes to sex even though guys, THAT IS NOT THE CASE! Cops are not immune to biases and victims often feel like male cops don’t believe them even when they are being respectful in their questioning.
h. Evidence is objective and doesn’t have biases. Every report needs to be thoroughly investigated and law enforcement and district attorney personnel should remember to look at the case objectively. This will protect the innocent whether it be the victim or a defendant victimized by a false report.
g. Evidence is what cleared these two individuals from facing charges. Aggies and sooners try to say that Mack paid off law enforcement, but they have to prove a case beyond reasonable doubt and most of us can agree that we had plenty of doubts in this case.
3. My thoughts on this case Remember that I wasn’t there and can only comment my opinion on the subject as anybody else has to date.
a. My red-flag radar was loudly pinging as I read the redacted police report and my first instinct was a false report.
b. Case is very popular among women as all of the Brothers McCoy are. This is especially true of those west of the Hill Country. When I heard the women involved were Tech Students, I immediately began to wonder if Case was the target of their affections and his refusal to have sex caused her to move on to Jordan as “plan B” with the hopes that either Case would sleep with her later or that she could nail them both with false rape charges. I hope this isn’t the case but the thoughts crossed my mind as I read her version of events.
c. The other thought that entered my mind was that as she sobered up she realized that that she might be pregnant and was ashamed of her promiscuous behavior. She may have cried rape to reconcile her actions that night with her conscience or to get a free morning after pill.
d. I do believe that a sex act occurred between the woman and Jordan Hicks but that she did consent to it and it was not unlawful.
e. I question why they didn’t separate Case McCoy from the case immediately following the first night. It is not against the law to be there or to even watch. I wonder if Law Enforcement was trying to prove that either he held her down or that he was ordering Jordan to perform certain acts. Neither of these were in the police report even from the victim’s point of view only that he “just stood there and watched.”
f. At the end of the day it is a blessing in disguise that Case McCoy was there because he saved Jordan from having to go to jail on these charges as he breaks the tie in a he said, she said type of case.
4. My thoughts on the clubbing and curfew issues
1. Case McCoy posted two photos on his instigram account that were on his phone the night of the incident. In one of the captions, he wishes a teammate a happy 21st birthday. Case was already 21 and Jordan is still 20 for several more months. My theory is that there more more players at the club than just Case and Jordan, but they were the only ones caught.
2. If there were others there, hopefully Mack will find out who they are and suspend them for one game next season as it is only fair since Case and Jordan had to serve suspensions for sneaking out.